20 Things Online Debate Has Taught Me
1. Correlation does not equal causation. But that doesn’t go far enough and apparently nothing causes anything. Seriously, guns don’t prevent crimes; tax cuts don’t affect the economy; water doesn’t cause wetness.
2. The phrases mean republicans and stupid democrats apparently pass for insightful commentary in some circles. More importantly, by uttering one of these phrases, you have won the debate.
3. A slight rip-off of Godwin’s Law, I introduce SayUncle’s Not-So-Much-A-Law-Really-But-Maybe-Just-General-Smarminess: As a blog discussion between a liberal and conservative grows longer, the probability of the phrase Well, Clinton . . . appearing approaches one.
4. Apparently, everything is a fallacy. But fallacies are also apparently fallacious. Which, therefore, makes all fallacies fallacy fallacies. As such, all arguments are therefore true. Or false. Or discredited. Or, you know, not so much.
5. If I engage you in an argument and you are a Republican/Democrat, then I must be a raving moonbat/extremist wingnut.
6. Similarly, if I am not a Republican, I must be a bunny-hugging liberal. Or if I am not a Democrat, I must be a right wing extremist.
7. To matter of factly prove my point, I only need one other person to agree with me. It helps if they have a syndicated column or a webpage.
8. People can Google up a webpage to prove anything. People can also Google up a webpage to disprove the thing you proved.
9. The word Nigger can either be racist or not, depending on who is using the word and in what context. However, the Confederate Flag is always racist no matter who displays it. As a result, there are a lot of racist museums.
10. If you want to keep the money you earn, you are greedy. If you want to pay taxes for essential services provided by the government, you are stupid.
11. All Republicans are greedy, mean-spirited pricks incapable of compassion.
12. All Democrats are stupid, illogical simpletons incapable of rational thought.
13. John McCain is not a greedy, mean-spirited prick incapable of compassion.
14. Zell Miller is not a stupid, illogical simpleton incapable of rational thought.
15. Taking the words written in the Constitution to mean what they say makes you an extremist.
16. If you disagree with a blogger and inform said blogger of such a disagreement in the comments section of their blog (which they provide in order to, you know, allow people to comment) then you are a troll. However, if you agree with said blogger and inform said blogger of such an agreement in the comments section of their blog, you offer insightful commentary.
17. If you are an absolutist with respect to the First Amendment, you are perfectly normal. However, if you are an absolutist with respect to the Second and Tenth Amendments, you are an extremist.
18. If you disagree with me, you must be an extremist.
19. If you can see things in black-and-white in any case, you are a simpleton. Or maybe an extremist.
20. If I initiate a debate with you, I am attacking you personally. However, if you engage me in a debate, then we’re just having a discussion.
So, what have you learned?
Update: Make it 21 things:
21. If I fail to mention something, I am wrong. As such, in this post I failed to mention a recipe for Italian wedding soup. I am therefore wrong.
June 4th, 2004 at 1:18 pm
14. Zell Miller is not a stupid, illogical simpleton incapable of rational thought.
Yes he is, too. Clearly everything you say is wrong. Hitler was wrong too. Therefore you must be a Nazi.
June 4th, 2004 at 1:19 pm
Corollary to #16:
16. (…) However, if you agree with said blogger and inform said blogger of such an agreement in the comments section of their blog, you offer insightful commentary.
To the trolls, however, you are a sheep.
June 4th, 2004 at 2:08 pm
“The word Nigger can either be racist or not, depending on who is using the word and in what context.”
I guess it’s hard to call the word racist when it’s used by a black, but I can’t think of any other contexts in whcih it is not racist, unless “using” the word includes uttering the word while discussing the word itself, reporting that someone else had used it, etc.
BTW, I like yoru separate “guns” and “lawyers” blogrolls. Are they new, or have they been there all along? If I were you, I’d reverse their order, and follow up with a third category for “money.” But then again, if I were you, I’d also reside in Tennessee, own three houses rather than one horrendously overpriced one, support gay marriage, blah blah blah…
June 4th, 2004 at 2:17 pm
I am not in your league as a blogger, yet I can certainly appreciate your words on this issue. In fact I probably have been guilty of many of these myself. It is good to have someone point these things out from time to time. So did I just agree with you, or am I a troll? oops.
June 4th, 2004 at 2:17 pm
XRLQ,
I use bloglines blogroll for categories. It is quite handy. And I use my old blogrolling account for those folks without feeds. They’re fairly new (last two weeks i think). I can’t figure out how to customize the order they appear in. It seems to either be new ones last when you create them; or alphabetical.
And I’m down to two houses now. Wanna buy one?
June 4th, 2004 at 3:43 pm
You forgot one:
22)If you don’t repudiate everything that someone with the same ideological bend says that happens to be particularly inflamatory, you are a bad person.
June 4th, 2004 at 4:47 pm
The word Nigger can either be racist or not, depending on who is using the word and in what context. However, the Confederate Flag is always racist no matter who displays it.
In direct violation of #4, I call straw man. Show me anybody who argues that it’s sometimes non-racist to say “nigger” but always racist to display the flag. In fact, I’m not aware of anyone who argues even the latter half, that it’s always racist to display the flag.
June 4th, 2004 at 4:51 pm
What a masterful list.
Insightfully Yours,
Wince
June 4th, 2004 at 4:54 pm
23) The facts are never against one side or the other on any particular issue. Any appearance that one party or the other is wrong about something and/or screwed up must simply be “media bias.”
June 4th, 2004 at 5:23 pm
I am a Southern, White, Heterosexual Male, so everything is automatically my fault and I must be a racist hillbilly redneck.
Actually, I am a hillbilly, so never mind…
June 4th, 2004 at 5:44 pm
Tom, don’t get all snippy :^)
I didn’t say it was the same person arguing that stuff.
June 4th, 2004 at 10:20 pm
Beautiful. Just beautiful.
June 4th, 2004 at 10:29 pm
26) Snarky comments are insightful. Elucidated comments are narcissistic.
June 4th, 2004 at 10:52 pm
So, what have you learned?
that SU woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning and put on his snarky pants.
seriously though, since you and I disagree on some things, yet agree on others, it’s encouraging to see actual by-god discourse rather than name calling and such.
I especially like #8, but Google is an effective tool, and not all of us can afford Nexis.
June 5th, 2004 at 11:18 am
I’ve learned that lots of people can’t (or won’t) spell well or use proper grammar in their online missives, but it’s “becuase their in a hurry.” If you point out their errors, then either you like to make yourself feel better by making others feel dumb, or “you can’t answer they’re agruement and can only pick on they’re grammer.”
June 5th, 2004 at 12:09 pm
*trying to think of smarmy, witty retort to enlighten the masses…nope…no retorts here…does that make me a moderate with nazi leanings?
June 5th, 2004 at 12:48 pm
This wonderful list is exactly why I never do political posts. Such discussions equate to running in mud. You end up covered in crap and getting nowhere.
June 7th, 2004 at 3:11 pm
Another rule I’ve noticed is this:
If you are liberal, the media panders to the right. If you are conservative the media are bleeding heart liberals.
June 7th, 2004 at 3:19 pm
Uncle:
Wasn’t trying to be snippy. Just enjoyed the opportunity to snarkily fly in the face of your snarky list. 🙂
June 10th, 2004 at 11:28 am
27) When following links Steven Den Beste has really, really long posts.
June 10th, 2004 at 3:31 pm
> 19. If you can see things in black-and-white in
> any case, you are a simpleton. Or maybe an
> extremist.
Maybe just colorblind. I once had a friend who saw lawns in vibrant orange. Don’t ask me what that means. Beats the hell out of me.
June 10th, 2004 at 4:27 pm
“Another rule I’ve noticed is this:
If you are liberal, the media panders to the right. If you are conservative the media are bleeding heart liberals.”
Too true. However, http://www.dailyhowler.com makes me think that the media is stupid and just succumbs to whoever has the best and loudest spin.
June 11th, 2004 at 9:50 pm
If you support Israel, you are a Zionazi fascist that wants to ethnically cleanse the world of Arabs. If you are a Muslim, you are an extremist, Jew-hating terrorist that wants to see the immediate destruction of Israel and all Jews.
June 4th, 2004 at 11:03 pm
Uncle’s List
SayUncle has a most xcellent list of things he has learned thru online debate.
I will be the first to say I don’t always agree with SU…
June 5th, 2004 at 10:18 am
I’m Right
Say Uncle has published a list of everything he has learned about online debate, and how to determine whether someone is right or wrong or right or left. Zuppa maritata Naples – Campania Preparation – Medium Serves 4 – 6…
June 10th, 2004 at 9:05 am
20 Things
Say Uncle: 20 Things Online Debate Has Taught Me. We should all learn them. By the way, Triticale has the last requirement, in case you…
June 10th, 2004 at 8:53 pm
10 Lessons of Political Blogging
This list is adapted from Say Uncle’s “20 Thing Online Debate has Taught Me.”
June 11th, 2004 at 1:09 pm
SaysUncle on Online Debate
SaysUncle has a pretty humorous (yet markedly valid) list of 20 things that online debate has taught him. Blog writers, message board posters, and IRC users should definitely take a peek (THIS MEANS YOU VN ISEULT!!!). While you’re at it,…
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