Other NRA Notes
A common theme on the floor, as usual, was new products consisted of:
Look! A slightly different AR-15
Look! A slightly different 1911
Look! A so slightly different as to be nearly indistinguishable XD
Not much new and exciting, really. The only new things I saw were scout rifle concepts and bolt rifle variants. In that theme, someone pointed out the Mossberg MVP (Mossberg Varmint Predator), a bolt action that takes AR-15 magazines. And I said Why not just get an AR?
May 3rd, 2011 at 11:12 am
I’ve been saying for a long time that if they made a 5.56 bolt action upper for the AR that it would sell very well.
May 3rd, 2011 at 11:18 am
“Not much new and exciting, really.”
Which NRA convention are we discussing?
You didn’t see the Browning 7/8s sized 1911 with the just released “Commander” size?
You didn’t see the new doings at Colt? Now marking the 6920 et al with the civilian logo “Sporter M4s”, I cried, I laughed, but mostly snickered.
You didn’t see Tony Miele at the Smith & Wesson display? I mean the big cheese of production himself to yell/discuss things.
Ruger’s CEO was on the floor and I got to ask him questions about the Ruger Gunsite Scout Rifle.
“And I said Why not just get an AR?”
Because they live in California, or the hunting regs forbid it, or the Fudd wants a bolt action for reloading or “increased accuracy” or because it tested well.
Lots of new optics, lots of new accessories.
May 3rd, 2011 at 11:21 am
You mean slightly different ARs and 1911s? No, I didn’t mention those at all.
May 3rd, 2011 at 11:27 am
Yeah but the Browning 7/8 1911s are in .22lr. It’s the new hotness.
May 3rd, 2011 at 11:31 am
22LR conversions were more last year’s new hotness. I didn’t really notice a new hotness this year.
May 3rd, 2011 at 12:03 pm
“a bolt action that takes AR-15 magazines. And I said Why not just get an AR?”
My similar thoughts on the Scout Rifles. Why not get an AR-10 or an FAL? You’re total weight won’t be more than a pound or two more, and sadly unless you shoot for the moon, the price is about the same.
Oh and you can pick up magazines for under a c-note!
May 3rd, 2011 at 1:08 pm
For the money, I have a hard time justifying a Scout Rifle over an AR clone.
May 3rd, 2011 at 1:29 pm
I own plenty of AR’s, I wouldn’t mind adding a fudd gun that takes AR mags to my safe. That’s what’s great about America, choices…
May 3rd, 2011 at 2:16 pm
A scout 308 should be in the neighborhood of 6lb or so without scope & rings. A 308 AR is gonna be 8.5lb or better without sights.
If I’m gonna be out all day, I’ll take the scout, thank you very much.
May 3rd, 2011 at 2:25 pm
PA hunting regs dont allow for semi-autos or more than 5 rounds in a mag.
No airguns either… even though most of the airguns there were marketed as hunting or target rifles.
I thought the AR pattern shotgun was interesting, if not way over-priced for the lack of build quality.
May 3rd, 2011 at 2:41 pm
Jim I think the Ruger is around 7lbs without glass.
May 3rd, 2011 at 3:29 pm
The new Mossie would allow one to put on a Silencer w/o having to fiddle with the gas pressure. So if one had to deal with a Level 4 Zed Out Break, and you had the Over Watch, and you didn’t want to reveal your position…. actually, I could see a silencer-equipped MVP being used at a Prairie Dog Shoot.
May 3rd, 2011 at 3:53 pm
“I didn’t really notice a new hotness this year.”
Hotness can go beyond the calendar year, e.g. the Pursuit of the Polymer Pistols.
However, you are right, nothing earth-shattering. I look at it this way, I’m a gun nut, I’ll travel 8 hours in a rental car to walk around for 8 hours to finger a bunch of guns. Heck, I’ll pay money to watch someone else talk about guns for hours on end in a movie.
Maybe you’re just getting burned out, or maybe maturing?
May 3rd, 2011 at 5:14 pm
I think there is a definite market for an AR-mag-compatible sporter — me, for one. If one spends time in familiarization with a bolt gun (oops, I implied “training”; lots of folks unlike that concept) impressively rapid rates of fire can be achieved. Couple that with high-cap mags, and a non-EBR appearance, and you have a package that is much more capable than it appears to be. Obviously, you won’t empty a mag in .00006 seconds like Bubba Ray sez he can do with his AR. All the same, I opine that many shooters would be more accurate with the bolt gun.
May 3rd, 2011 at 5:59 pm
MVP in 300 Whisper/Black. It would look be hot as hell with a 20rnd p-mag filled with 220gr subsonics.
I bet the CZ-527 is much higher quality, but 5 vs 30 round is something to consider.
May 3rd, 2011 at 7:32 pm
Y’orta try a right handed bolt rifle left handed. I can clear a 10rd mag in about 15 seconds on target. For a scout rifle, I have an Ishapore Enfield jungle carbine in 7.62×51. Wangled a scope onto it, removable 10rd mags, indestructible military rifle. Don’t think I have $400 in it with extra mags and the scope. I be scoutin! For 5.56, yeah, got me an AR. Cleared a couple of possums in the attic with an M4. Don’t think I’d go scoutin with 5.56 though. Wanna hurt ’em harder.
May 3rd, 2011 at 9:19 pm
“Why not just get an AR”
Accuracy, velocity/power, and reliability. In 5.56 it’s still a varmint rifle though.
May 3rd, 2011 at 10:07 pm
Have we hit the technological limit of putting small pieces of metal downrange? Is there anywhere for the industry to go? Are we now limited to “tweaking” existing technology? Are there any drastic improvements similar to the arrival of Glock to the industry on the horizon?
May 3rd, 2011 at 10:07 pm
Kimber has a new 1911 aimed at the forgetful old men market. It is exactly the same product as they have been selling for years, and you have one in your safe that you haven’t fired yet.
May 4th, 2011 at 8:37 am
Geez, Unc, get a little more blase and cynical and you’ll be almost as cool as me. 😉
(I’ll point out that the Browning gun isn’t a “.22LR conversion” any more than a Walther P-22 is a “P-99 conversion”… And therefore I have absolutely no use for it.)
Well, their marketing department was obviously a drastic improvement.
If you mean striker-fired ignition, which has been around since the dawn of time, or the trigger safety, which Sauer debuted in the ’30s, or the polymer frame, which showed up on the HK VP70 back when Gaston was still making curtain rods and shoeboxes, or…
May 4th, 2011 at 11:22 am
Ok, ok…Tam…whew.
So, then we haven’t had any improvements at all? I’m not familiar with the history….but you’re right. The Glock marketing worked. VP70 didn’t lead to a transformation.
I can’t wait until either lasers or rail guns become hand held….
May 4th, 2011 at 11:49 am
Any improvements at all?
That’s a good question.
I’d say that, pretty much since the late 19th and early 20th Century, when recoil energy or gas pressure were harnessed to operate a repeating firearm’s action, a process made possible by smokeless powder and jacketed projectiles, firearms technology has largely been stagnant.
All improvements since then have been solely matters of materials used or manufacturing techniques (stampings, castings, alloys, injection-molded polymers replacing milled steel forgings) but as far as anything really revolutionary? Not really.
There have been attempts: the Gyrojet, caseless ammo, Metalstorm… but nothing’s really caught on yet.
Like the internal combustion engine, the metallic cartridge firearm is a very mature, very evolved technology. There are things that may theoretically be better, but non that have been developed enough to overcome their shortcomings yet.
May 5th, 2011 at 11:30 am
Late to the party again, sorry.
A manual rifle that takes AR maggys? Don’t go all ga-ga until you handle a Remington Patrol Rifle in .223. Slide action, same controls as the familiar 870 shotgun, and all the fast-pumping shooty goodness you’d ever need.
BTW, a 20-round Fudd rifle is a concept that clashes badly with game laws in many states, which limit all repeating rifles for big game to 5-round maggys. In Oregon, you can CARRY a bigger mag, but it better not be in the gun when your friendly game warden chats with you out in the field.
Still, go look at the Remington 7625. If you want a hi-cap manual rifle, it’s the one for you (unless your State also bans .22 caliber for big game, but I think most states have changed on that once-universal concept).
May 6th, 2011 at 3:38 pm
Rivrdog,
It’d be the berries for prairie dogs and such off a rest with a 20-rd mag.