Empathy
Via Robb, comes an interesting article that posits that while moderates and conservatives can better guess a self-identified liberal’s responses to questions, the self-identified liberals have a difficult time guessing how conservatives and moderates would answer questions.
I have found that when I’m debating a few of my liberal friends that we’re often not speaking the same language. Or even close. Maybe that’s why.
March 23rd, 2012 at 9:53 am
I need to be careful not to fall into the trap of “Ooh, this purely unbiased, scientific study proves my point! That study about how most gun owners are paranoid racists? Totally Bogus!”
However, your point about not speaking the same language is valid. We have differing first principles than statists (of either side). We believe that maximizing individual liberty results in a better life for everyone. Statists believe that individual freedom needs to be curtailed in order to provide the maximum amount of equality / social cohesion.
When you believe in individualism, you’re probably more likely to grant people their right to be stupid. So, we can accept that some people will make poor choices (like believing in ‘progressivism’ which is anything but). So, we can live with the fact that people do not believe in what we believe because our beliefs can withstand opposing views.
When you believe that the individual is subverted for a ‘greater good’, you no longer are required to accept that there are other views because it damages yours. Thus, first principles differ to the point where we’re not arguing the same thing.
March 23rd, 2012 at 9:56 am
I don’t place a lot of faith in any social science study. But I find them interesting.
March 23rd, 2012 at 10:11 am
Also, Peterson Syndrome. It isn’t just language that limits your discourse with liberal progressives. It is their inability to process factual information to arrive at a conclusion logically, based on rational arguments.
That is another way of saying their ideology trumps everything, but hey, it sure is annoying trying to understand how they think until you realize they don’t.
March 23rd, 2012 at 11:07 am
I was discussing federal regulations with a liberal. I noted that SpaceX was producing rockets cheaper and faster than the government because they didn’t hae as many regulations to deal with. And I thought it should stay that way.
“Oh, you don’t care if the rockets are unsafe?”
March 23rd, 2012 at 12:09 pm
Whenever something is futile I say “its like trying to reason with a liberal”. You might as well give up now because its not going to end the way you want it to, they can understand logical reasoning.
March 23rd, 2012 at 4:38 pm
What’s amusing about all these comments – and most statements like these by both liberals and conservatives – is that the speaker/writer dehumanizes, stereotypes, and dismisses the other out of hand by saying things like they’re incapable of thinking rationally. If you don’t understand why the other side holds the opinions they do, then you will never be able to prove your point and all you’ll have left is being dismissive and condescending. If you underestimate your opponent’s ability or the veracity of their argument, then you’ve just brought a knife to a gun fight.
Also, most arguments I read or hear, from either side of an issue, aren’t rational, are fraught with logical fallacies, or they’re premised on dubious information. So, to dismiss an opposing view because what you’ve heard or read of it hasn’t been soundly reasoned may be due to the speaker’s / writer’s own error, rather than the point being argued itself being false.
I’ve learned to make a conscious effort to not underestimate or dismiss someone with an opposing view just because I don’t understand why they have that view. And, when I have an opinion and am presented with contrary information, if this information is verifiable and well-reasoned, then I will swallow my pride and change my opinion. For example, I was raised by parents that believe guns are mostly bad. A few years ago I got an itch to learn to shoot, and while reading-up on guns and shooting and all the social issues surrounding them, I came to realize that the facts did not support my opinion that they’re mostly bad. As a result, I’m now a member of the NRA, my wife and I own several guns, are avid shooters, and frequently invite friends and family to come shoot with us in hopes of showing them that guns are mostly good. Also, I’m a liberal, proving that at least one of us liberals isn’t mindless drone, and therefore your bigoted generalization is patently false.
Honestly, it’s been fascinating and enlightening to see the conservative and libertarian views from the other side and to learn the reasoning and world-view behind them. I used to be bigoted about my liberal views and dismissed anything contrary, and though my mind hasn’t been changed about most of my opinions, I no longer believe that all conservative and libertarian views are the result of faulty reasoning, ignorance, and short-sightedness.
March 23rd, 2012 at 6:04 pm
“I no longer believe that all conservative and libertarian views are the result of faulty reasoning, ignorance, and short-sightedness.”
How big of you.
March 23rd, 2012 at 8:58 pm
“SpaceX was producing rockets cheaper and faster than the government because didn’t hae as many regulations to deal with.”
Conservatives love this kind of sound bite. If something is cheaper and faster (never mind that it’s apples to oranges), it must be “government regulations” creating the difference.
March 23rd, 2012 at 11:21 pm
“Conservatives love this kind of sound bite. If something is cheaper and faster (never mind that it’s apples to oranges), it must be “government regulations” creating the difference.”
And if you’re a liberal, it must mean that something is also dangerous and must therefore fall under the jurisdiction and regulation of some sanctimonious government organization that requires power not given to it by the Constitution.
Boy, this is fun!
March 24th, 2012 at 1:28 am
Hmm. I wonder whether we should take bottles of hand sanitizer into polling places on voting day and leave them on the registration desks…
March 24th, 2012 at 1:35 am
Leftists are crippled by the basic epistemology that defines Leftism. Think methheads who “partake in the product”. Essentially, Leftists have twisted themselves away from objective reality to the point that they have “pinched off” and become adrift, with no remaining common conceptual ground with those of us still grounded in it. (The joke on the “reality-based community” is that the mirror image of that phrase — “community-based reality” — is actually a good descriptor of what I’m getting at here.)
For a Leftist to be able to distinguish between an opponents actual ideas and bis own febrile caricatures of those ideas, he must posses a certain minimum level of functional epistemology — of rationality — to be able to grasp the opposing ideas on their own terms *and* in relation to reality. They do not have it, because their basic ideas specifically forbid it.
The same cannot be said of “the right”, however — because it, unlike the Left, is not monolithic. Rightists, here defined loosely as “non-Left”, have wildly varying epistemologies, from the similarly disconnected and corrupting influence of religious faith (hi Rick!) to the grounded rationality of (some) libertarians, as well as that sizeable cadre of pro-liberty individuals who erroneously self-identify as “conservative”.
As an Objectivist, I think I can predict both Leftist and conservative reactions to a much higher degree than either can predict the other (and both are abysmal at predicting my answers to things, due to their febrile caricatures of what Objectivism is).
March 24th, 2012 at 4:48 am
It appears that everyone who commented after my comment didn’t read mine – it’s ridiculously giant and hard to miss – or missed the point entirely, because all of you replied with the same dismissive condescension, the same blatant arrogance that I described.
And Seerak, your comment that the left is monolithic betrays you; you clearly have no idea what you’re talking bout.
March 24th, 2012 at 12:28 pm
Many leftists seem to refute the notion that there are any absolutes. Even basic concepts such as “truth” or “beauty” are mutable to them. This renders real communication between leftists and non-leftists all but impossible.