If Same-Sex Marriage Is so Popular, Why Does It Always Lose at the Ballot Box?
That’s the question. I think the answer is fairly simple: older people vote, younger people like shit on facebook.
8 Responses to “If Same-Sex Marriage Is so Popular, Why Does It Always Lose at the Ballot Box?”
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May 15th, 2012 at 9:48 am
Its popularity does not matter. Individual rights are never up for a popular vote, no matter what. Isn’t that what we are always telling people about RKBA? Haven’t we always blasted the ACLU for doing the same with the 2A? I’m not going to partake in gay marriage, but that doesn’t mean that I have to dictate my choice to others.
May 15th, 2012 at 10:09 am
@Divemedic I don’t think there is the straight line analogy you’re trying to make with the RKBA. The argument isn’t for the right to associate with whomever you choose it the the argument for a 3rd party (The people of the US) to sanction your union and there by your receive some extra perceived benefit via that recognition.
That said I personally think the US Government should be out of the “Marriage” business all together the rules for secular unions should be worked out via standard contracts. The terms of those contracts should be controlling. If the Federal Govt didn’t try to push policy via the tax code this issue really could be moot.
In a nut shell I argue “Marriage” in the context it’s being debated isn’t an individual right as the “Right” is relying on a third party to both grant and validate it. YMMV
May 15th, 2012 at 10:16 am
Another issue is that the ones behind these bans tend to carefully select their timing. The recent vote in NC is a perfect example. It took place during a primary election where the Democratic presidential ticket is already completely settled, so few Democrats (more likely to oppose banning same-sex marriage) showed, and most of the people who showed up were the die-hard Republicans (more likely to favour banning same-sex marriage). After all, if your party’s ticket is already settled, why bother? Primary and non-November elections are when (generally) only the most active party activists participate, again skewing the demographic for each party to the extremes.
I read somewhere that only 13% of NC voters actually participated. Since this was essentially a Republican primary with some other stuff attached, the demographic was pretty well skewed. “Most people” and “most people that actually showed up to vote” are not the same thing, thus the disconnect.
May 15th, 2012 at 10:59 am
Jake, except that polling never showed opposition reaching a majority at all.
May 15th, 2012 at 11:36 am
SPQR: And then there’s the inconvenient example of Prop 8 in California, which passed during a general election in arguably the most gay-friendly state in the Union, with Barack Obama at the top of the ticket and winning by more than 10 percentage points.
Despite the media’s simplistic portrayal of the issue, gay marriage is much more complex than most people think; simple polls showing a majority of Americans in favor of the concept do not accurately predict how they will actually vote on the issue.
May 15th, 2012 at 11:44 am
It would be nice if you could draw up a contract that had all the benefits of marriage. Of course you can’t.
Courts routinely (or they did at one time – I haven’t followed it recently) thrown out such contracts and install elderly parents as in charge. This was mostly around medical power of attorney for AIDS cases.
And I can’t draw up a contract that will allow my partner to arrange my funeral benefits, because the law doesn’t recognize my right to delegate that. So if I don’t pre-plan, it reverts to family. Blood family.
If you held a vote in the 1960s, I doubt you would have gotten a majority in favor of interracial marriage. I doubt you would have gotten a majority vote in the 1950s in favor of integrating the armed services.
I could almost agree with you if there wasn’t so much tied up with marriage. Like retirement benefits, and tax breaks – yes, people talk about the marriage tax, but look at what happens to estate taxes once the “bush tax cuts” expire this year. And they will expire. Partners pay estate taxes. Married couples do not.
And most of the opposition to same-sex marriage comes down to “my religion forbids it.” Well, sorry, but your religion doesn’t make the laws in this country. Or it shouldn’t.
Here’s an idea. Let’s stop debating same-sex marriage, and debate the right to not be fired because of who you love. Do you think corporations should be able to fire people because they are gay? Do you think corporations should be able to fire people because they own guns?
Uncle, You are right. Old people vote more than the young. That’s why you have wander through the desert for 40 years – to wait for the old folks to check out – before you can reach the promised land. (Do you think it took 40 years to walk from Cairo to Jerusalem? You could probably do it in 40 days). So eventually those callus youngsters will grow up and vote. And the bigoted elders will have passed on. Isn’t there a song about “time is on my side?”
May 15th, 2012 at 4:47 pm
Jake, you completely ignored Prop 8 in California- a very left-leaning state and a ballot in November 2008, one of the biggest turnouts all over the country for an election.
May 15th, 2012 at 5:15 pm
Guess it just proves the left is trying to make an issue out of what the rest of the country considers a given… Gay Marriage is out if you vote for it by popular vote.. Now if you get it in using corrupt politicians and judges is that following the will of the VAST majority or the will of the tiny minority??? Hence not the will of the people.