Bleg: Chemical Deterrents
Pepper spray and such. What’s a good brand? For the Mrs. And, heck, I’d get one too.
At a parking lot once, someone became a bit too friendly with the kids. I wasn’t there. The Mrs. said she thought the guy may have been thinking about snatching my girl. And, in that situation, I imagine a spray is more effective. Sure, it will hurt the kids but not seriously. As opposed to a stray 45 round.
December 18th, 2009 at 3:14 pm
Go through a LE friend and get the LE stuff. I’ve been sprayed by fresh off the shelf stuff and the LE stuff during my stint at the academy, and let me say, the LE stuff sucks. The off the shelf does work to a point, but it is no where near as powerful.
December 18th, 2009 at 3:16 pm
I carry Fox Labs pepper spray. I read a lot of reviews of various types and it was highly recommended. I also bought some decontaminations wipes they sell. Might be a good idea for you too in the situation you describe if Junior were to get hit as well as the goblin.
December 18th, 2009 at 3:21 pm
The Mrs. has a Kimber Guardian. When it expires, I’m seriously thinking about testing it out myself just to see how it works. If I do, I’ll YouTube it for everyone to see 😉
December 18th, 2009 at 3:25 pm
Fox labs international. The 2% OC 5.3 solution they use is wicked stuff. It got all the prisoners talking about it the first time we used it after switching to it. For the personal defense spray the cone gives a close to medium fogging spray and the stream reaches out farther of course in a single stream.
December 18th, 2009 at 3:28 pm
link
December 18th, 2009 at 3:29 pm
I give up trying to figure out how to post a link.
December 18th, 2009 at 3:44 pm
You have to select some text then hit the link button.
December 18th, 2009 at 4:12 pm
I’ve been in those situations occasionally. Last time was at the DMV, some creepy guy was eyeing my girls but trying to hide it. Fortunately about the time Chris made his way back to us he stopped.
A couple of things to keep in mind:
Firearms aren’t allowed everywhere, so a backup method is always a good idea (no weapons in the DMV). I’m not a fan of pepper spray but it works.
A properly weighted purse with a good long strap makes a damn good backup weapon. I personally carry my purse across my body (its actually really a netbook bag) and its got a good long and wide strong nylon strap. Sure if I had to use it as a bludgeoning device I’d probably kill my Eee, but it would do the job. As a bonus, carrying a purse cross-body leaves two hands free (one for each child) and makes concealed carry easier as you can carry IWB behind where the purse rests.
December 18th, 2009 at 4:20 pm
X2 for Kimber Guardian; it is what I carry in bars and such, also give it to the wife when she travels.
Funny you said that Robb, because I was going to test mine also, but I never thought of sharing it with the world.
December 18th, 2009 at 4:21 pm
Oh, also check your local laws, as I know WI has a maximum OC% contained law. (Though it’s really meaningless as it doesn’t do a good job of saying how to measure it, and the potency of the initial resin isn’t taken into account. Whatever).
December 18th, 2009 at 4:34 pm
Mike Gallo: If asked, the spray was kept for use on viscous dogs.
As long as your stated intent was not self-defense against humans …
December 18th, 2009 at 4:43 pm
Viscous: Having a thick, sticky consistency between solid and liquid. 😉
December 18th, 2009 at 4:48 pm
I had one once that seemed to have gone past an expire data and I thought I would “unload” it. did not wear a glove and my hand burned for about 24 hours.
You might want to try one just to make sure all the spray goes down range as if it doesn’t it will be a toss up if you incapacitate you or the assailant.
As I recall it was around 5% of some really nasty substance.
December 18th, 2009 at 4:48 pm
I’m going to echo the replies for Fox Labs. We carry the stuff in 6% as well – much more powerful than the 2% LEO issued spray and it also has a green marking dye (FTC disclaimer: I get paid to write this stuff). It’s what I got for my wife.
December 18th, 2009 at 4:52 pm
Here in (ahem) gun-free Chicagoland area, I carry no less than one Kimber Guardian and a 2oz Mace CS/OC (sometimes more).
Never had to use them.
December 18th, 2009 at 4:54 pm
+1 to the Fox Labs.
I’d rather be sprayed by ANY other brand than the Fox. Only brand I’ll carry now.
Little Fox Labs story: I used to run a security guard training business. About once a month we’d have a pepper spray course. At the end we would spray the students and have them work through a little dexterity/defend yourself course before hitting the water hose.
One of our helpers, early 20’s with more balls than brains, would volunteer to get sprayed first and show the students what to do on the course. He would then stand next to the water hose and help all the other students decontaminate before he himself would wash the pepper off. The guy wouldn’t even flinch, while most of the other students were whimpering and rushing to the water.
When I got in a can of the Fox Labs, I asked if he would let me spray him with it rather than the normal spray we used – for testing purposes. He agreed and we did so at the next class.
I sprayed him and he grunted, made it two steps into the dexterity course, dropped to his knees and asked us to take him to the water – right now!
My own experience is similar – that stuff is hot!
December 18th, 2009 at 4:59 pm
My preffered poison is a coin toss between Freeze +P and BLUE FOX. Both are very good and effective sprays. However for civilian use I would suggest a Foam, the foam works just as good but unlike the liquid it sticks to the offender(napalm sticks to kids) and will stain thier clothes, skin etc. And unlike the liquid it is not as easy to decon and get rid of on the fly, point being if you have to use it, it hangs around a bit!
December 18th, 2009 at 5:01 pm
I’m sure your wife and Mrs. Byrne were perfectly correct in their reactions, but is it possible that some people are just friendly/outgoing? I wouldn’t want this country to get to the point that if your glance happens to fall on a child someone is flicking the safety off on her 1911. *preemptively flees from torrent of vitriol*
December 18th, 2009 at 5:18 pm
I carry Fox Labs Mean Green in the keychain 3/4 oz size
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/TAC163-1.html
New Jersey, where i work, has a maximum size limit, but unless you routinely carry the stuff in a fire extinguisher, you should be ok. of course in PA, where i am live, i carry the Mean Green AND my gun. can’t shoot someone for simple assault after all.
December 18th, 2009 at 5:19 pm
Crap, try this link
December 18th, 2009 at 5:21 pm
you have to select text to make a link.
December 18th, 2009 at 5:40 pm
I actually bought mine here
http://www.defensedevices.com
December 18th, 2009 at 5:40 pm
Snatching your little girl? I’d be afraid pepper spray would just piss scumbags like that off. I’d say definitely have a gun as backup in case he doesn’t take off.
December 18th, 2009 at 5:45 pm
Decent point. But he’d let go to rub his eyes. At that point, he has a very important decision to make about whether staying or going is in his best interest.
December 18th, 2009 at 6:17 pm
Like Caleb and his coffee, it would be enough to shift initiative and make him run.
I said “the LE stuff sucks” earlier, I mean that in a it freakin’ hurts.
I believe the LE stuff I got sprayed with was Fox Labs.
December 18th, 2009 at 6:35 pm
Agree on the Fox brand green or orange dye-marking products, agree that foam is better than fog.
Here in Texas a 4 ox Fox cannister will depressurize (not leak, just lose pressure) after 6 months in a hot car, leaving about 0.5 seconds of spray left, compared with the several seconds of spray power from a new can.
That Montana Bear Spray stuff would also work pretty well, I suppose.
December 18th, 2009 at 6:42 pm
Err no offense, but why isn’t the silenced .22 SayAunt’s carry weapon? No noise, no recoil, it might take her a week to learn how to shoot it.
December 18th, 2009 at 7:10 pm
rrk: yea, I’m starting to hate spell checkers.
I need a Do What I Meant checker.
December 18th, 2009 at 7:45 pm
I bought the Kimber product for my mom and the misses. I too would like to try it after it expires. Im by no means .mil or LEO but i have been sprayed a few times to see if I could do it by friends. I’ve also been hit with a taser. I would not be able to fight after either of those, so unless you’re really jacked up on god knows what or just dead nuts determined either one will stop you. A 440 volt TIG welder will also knock you on your butt, actually blew myself against the wall with one of those. But, that would be a bit hard to conceal lol.
December 18th, 2009 at 8:36 pm
fox labs rocks. I use to run a kitchen and one night after closing sitting out on the patio bar some of my guys starting bragging about “manly feats of strength” so I sez to ’em “think you can take a shot of pepper spray?” One of my guys said he could. crazy guy, I once cut glass out of his upper arm with my pocket knife a week after a car wreck no problem, been a bouncer, loved to fight. Two steps and that was it. His sinuses emptied snot, spit, drool, tears, anything that could leak was leaking. He was useless for a good half-hour and he will never do it again. I carry it and the handy fogger bombs they make. But be warned they will loose their pressure over time, or mine do after about a year and a half in a hot/cold car. check ’em occasionally because just cause they feel full doesn’t mean they have pressure behind them.
December 18th, 2009 at 8:37 pm
I personally would not go with the foam. Foam works great in a small contained environment where you want to maintain minimal cross contamination. Out in the open if you don’t hit your target with the foam it’s won’t affect the bad guy. Stream has the best range but you have to “aim” a bit to hit your target. Fog would be best for the type of encounter you describe. Up close and personal. You will probably get yourself in the process but as long as you are pointed in the general direction of the bad guy you will get him.
I’m sure some of the other’s suggested work well but the Fox 5.3 is what you want. It’s not the OC percentage that makes this stuff great it’s the formula that makes it so potent. And don’t worry about the bad guy being able to get you. If you hit him with this stuff he won’t be able to open his eyes to see you.I’ve seen this stuff bring gas eaters to their knees.
December 18th, 2009 at 9:08 pm
Fox, as stated by many above. NO NEED for “LE Only” and such; the idiots who write the laws restricting OC products specify percentages (as in, 2% for civilians, 10% for LE, etc.), where what matters is the SHU. The reason why Fox is so potent is that its SHUs exceed other OC sprays, not its percentage.
Just remember that career criminals understand that even Fox won’t kill them or even do them lasting harm. Discomfort, yes. But it will not end the fight with a motivated (or crazy) adversary.
December 18th, 2009 at 10:34 pm
Be sure and check your local laws.
I can carry a concealed firearm legally but CAN NOT carry pepper spray if it is concealed.
December 18th, 2009 at 11:43 pm
anon: Is it possible people are being friendly? Perhaps. I’m an elementary school teacher, and I’m used to being very outgoing to children. I have to intentionally tone it down when I’m not teaching.
But, here’s what’s important: a theory doesn’t have to be true, it just has to be useful. In other words, it certainly isn’t true that every person who eyes your children is a malignant kidnapper. However, it is productive to act as though it were true. Therefore, always assume the worst about other peoples’ intentions toward your children.
Oh, and that little feeling on the back of your neck when something’s not right? You can’t explain it to anyone else, and you should always trust it.
December 19th, 2009 at 12:00 am
Fox Labs says the same thing that “Jailer” says, that they recommend cone-fog units for civilian carry.
here’s the link to their products page.
Fox Labs
December 19th, 2009 at 1:32 am
Having very limited experience with sprays, these comments are frickin’ valuable. Fox it is, for me, the missus, and her slightly loony jogging-at-night best friend.
December 19th, 2009 at 2:07 am
I carry fox and have lived in downtown Memphis for 6 or 7 years. I can say without a doubt it’s very effective on crackheads.
December 19th, 2009 at 4:43 am
Look, crazy as it sounds I can now vouch for the effectiveness of the fox labs spray. To keep a long story short I just used it to keep myself unblemished.
December 19th, 2009 at 9:04 am
Ladies who don’t like guns might themselves be surprised with what they can do with a knife. They use them all the time at home.
December 19th, 2009 at 11:16 am
http://www.tigerlight.net/Home_Page.html
I’ve read good things about it and the guys on the Gun Dudes Podcast just love it.
December 19th, 2009 at 12:35 pm
+1 Fox Labs. LAPD approved. Carry it every I walk the German Shedders. It’ll slow down even pit bulls.
December 19th, 2009 at 7:58 pm
This is excellent information and nowadays a variety of self defense items such as stun guns, pepper spray, and personal alarms, etc are made to be disguised as everyday ordinary items, like cell phones, pens, perfumes, and pagers. Any of these items can be purchased online at http://www.businessforceltd.com if you cant find a store in your city or cant get out to purchase them. Self defense items are a necessity for all people because you never know what situations life may bring you
December 22nd, 2009 at 1:02 pm
@ Zach – FYI there is a ban on any chemical self-defense products in Chicago proper.